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Paddy C 
"Does not compute! Lame!"
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 Posted - 01/18/2007 : 11:01:17
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Maybe I'm getting cynical in my old age, but I really didn't enjoy this movie. Why should Will Smith get an oscar nod for doing something actors are supposed to do in every film they're in, dammit!! "Hey, look, Will's acting!" Fair play to him, as he does alright, but I reckon this is more of a corrective action on his part rather than anything we should be applauding...  
Meanwhile, brilliant comedic performances, like Aaron Eckhart in 'Thank You for Smoking', and Sacha Baron Cohen in 'Borat' are almost guaranteed to be overlooked by Oscar, due to a blatant and unhealthy derision for movies that make people laugh. The Golden Globes are beginning to seem far more relevant than the Oscars..
Do yourself a favour, and give 'The Pursuit of Happyness' a big fat miss. (and if you're still not sure how I feel about this movie, have a read of the more-than-four-word review..  |
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Demisemicenturian 
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 11:15:24
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The Pursuit of Happyness
I enjoyed it, and I don't think they could have done much better with the story, but my problem with it is that the message is (obviously) that money and only money will make one happy. At the beginning, Smith's character comments how happy all the stockbrokers look (and in particular they look relaxed) - that is not my experience of financial sector workers at all. The other message is that one can fight one's way out of poverty if one just tries hard enough. This is simply not true; one has to have the right combination of intelligence, personality and luck. I find that self-made millionaires always have this attitude.
I agree that comedy is often overlooked by the Oscars. They seem to assume that unhappiness requires the best acting. I don't really see how Thank You For Smoking (2005) is eligible, but if it's eligible for the Golden Globes, then I suppose it may as well be eligible for the Oscars.
Re: your blog, I preferred The Aviator to The Departed; the latter did not really have so much on top of the basic concept. You're right that Forest Whitaker should definitely win; it's quite amazing to portray two different sides to a person so convincingly. (I have just seen on the I.M.D.B. that he was originally cast to play Sawyer in Lost! As good an actor as he is, I find this completely incomprehensible.) |
Edited by - Demisemicenturian on 07/13/2007 12:15:27 |
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ChocolateLady
"500 Chocolate Delights"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 11:23:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Salopian
The Pursuit of Happyness
I enjoyed it, and I don't think they could have done much better with the story, but my problem with it is that the message is (obviously) that money and only money will make one happy. At the beginning, Smith's character comments how happy all the stockbrokers look (and in particular they look relaxed) - that is not my experience of financial sector workers at all. The other message is that one can fight one's way out of poverty if one just tries hard enough. This is simply not true; one has to have the right combination of intelligence, personality and luck. I find that self-made millionaires always have this attitude.
Hm... if that's the message, I won't go see it. So there!
(That should make those money grubbing producers take notice!!!)
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Paddy C
"Does not compute! Lame!"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 12:15:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Salopian
the message is (obviously) that money and only money will make one happy. The other message is that one can fight one's way out of poverty if one just tries hard enough. I find that self-made millionaires always have this attitude.
I preferred The Aviator to The Departed.
Couldn't agree with you more on 'Happyness'. There are thousands of books written by successful people, preaching about how all you need to do is stay positive, create your own opportunities, all that self-righteous revisionism of their own path to success, which, as you say, involves luck as well as ability.. also, the majority of people don't enjoy multi-million dollar success.. But this fact does not make good movies, apparently... I would have preferred Happyness if the main character had found self-respect through living his life, rather than simply pursuing cash money dollars.
Re 'the Aviator', I liked that movie an awful lot, but I'm a sucker for the classic Martin Scorcese cops and robber movies (Casino, Goodfellas et al). The Departed was a great cast, all performing really well, so even though the Aviator was great, I was more entertained by 'the Departed' (i just like that type of movie more). Cate Blanchett was unbelievably good in the Aviator though, and that movie changed my opinion of DiCaprio too. |
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ChocolateLady
"500 Chocolate Delights"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 12:47:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
Cate Blanchett was unbelievably good in the Aviator though, and that movie changed my opinion of DiCaprio too.
I will NOT watch that film. All the clips I saw of Blanchett playing Katharine Hepburn showed me that they got her ALL wrong. They made her into a cheap, party-girl, fame-chaser and she was NEVER that at all. Hollywood did Hepburn a huge disservice by portraying her that way and she deserves far, far better treatment than that.
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:08:03
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quote:
Originally posted by ChocolateLady
I will NOT watch that film. All the clips I saw of Blanchett playing Katharine Hepburn showed me that they got her ALL wrong. They made her into a cheap, party-girl, fame-chaser and she was NEVER that at all. Hollywood did Hepburn a huge disservice by portraying her that way and she deserves far, far better treatment than that.
I haven't seen it since it first came out, but I don't remember her being like that at all. She is presented as someone who followed her own path in life rather than conforming to society, and who both had integrity and inspired it in others. |
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Paddy C
"Does not compute! Lame!"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:14:13
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quote:
Originally posted by ChocolateLady
quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
Cate Blanchett was unbelievably good in the Aviator though, and that movie changed my opinion of DiCaprio too.
I will NOT watch that film. All the clips I saw of Blanchett playing Katharine Hepburn showed me that they got her ALL wrong. They made her into a cheap, party-girl, fame-chaser and she was NEVER that at all. Hollywood did Hepburn a huge disservice by portraying her that way and she deserves far, far better treatment than that.
I don't think the Hepburn character in the Aviator was that straight-forward... she comes across as strong-willed and intelligent, but that could be interpreted positively or negatively. (I.e. cold and calculating, or smart and driven). She's a party-girl in comparison to Hughes, but he was a sociopath so that comparison is probably irrelevant... |
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Paddy C
"Does not compute! Lame!"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:24:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Salopian
Some telling differences between the real story and the film story...
[SPOILER ALERT]
That's interesting, so they took some pretty big liberties... aging the son i don't mind, allows the main character to have more dialogue, but the $1,000 a month stipend is pretty important.
[/END SPOILER]
I just noticed the name of his consultancy as well 'Gardner Rich' with the 'Rich' part named after some stockbroker!? I don't believe that for a second, the guy was money-driven, and this company name declares his wealth to the world. I'm starting to like this character, and this movie, less and less!! |
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ChocolateLady
"500 Chocolate Delights"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:31:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
quote:
Originally posted by Salopian
Some telling differences between the real story and the film story...
[SPOILER ALERT]
That's interesting, so they took some pretty big liberties... aging the son i don't mind, allows the main character to have more dialogue, but the $1,000 a month stipend is pretty important.
[/END SPOILER]
I just noticed the name of his consultancy as well 'Gardner Rich' with the 'Rich' part named after some stockbroker!? I don't believe that for a second, the guy was money-driven, and this company name declares his wealth to the world. I'm starting to like this character, and this movie, less and less!!
I happen to know of the broker Marc Rich, so that could be right.
(Marc lives up to his surname very, Very, VERY well - but he does donate to charity these days.)
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:34:37
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[Reply to spoiler]
Yes, the stipend makes a huge difference. Anyone could live off that much a month in 1981. Another significant difference is that he had not invested all his savings in the scanners, so he could just have got another normal job when that one didn't work out.
[/End spoiler]
quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
I just noticed the name of his consultancy as well 'Gardner Rich' with the 'Rich' part named after some stockbroker!? I don't believe that for a second, the guy was money-driven, and this company name declares his wealth to the world.
Yes, I thought that too.
quote:
I'm starting to like this character, and this movie, less and less!!
And that! |
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 13:38:29
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quote:
Originally posted by ChocolateLady
I happen to know of the broker Marc Rich
Seems like a piece of work. |
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demonic
"Cinemaniac"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 14:44:01
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quote:
Originally posted by ChocolateLady
quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
Cate Blanchett was unbelievably good in the Aviator though, and that movie changed my opinion of DiCaprio too.
I will NOT watch that film. All the clips I saw of Blanchett playing Katharine Hepburn showed me that they got her ALL wrong. They made her into a cheap, party-girl, fame-chaser and she was NEVER that at all. Hollywood did Hepburn a huge disservice by portraying her that way and she deserves far, far better treatment than that.
I think you're missing out CL - it's a brilliant multi-faceted performance by the best actress of her generation, and a very worthy Oscar winner. Bear in mind that the clips you saw of the film were probably chosen by advertising executives trying to sell the film and not particularly representative of the finished product - Hepburn doesn't come across the way you supposed at all. In fact she's seen as the only true friend and perhaps love of Hughes' entire life. Also if you know Blanchett's work at all, you know that she's not the kind of performer who'd disrespect the character she's playing in any way. I'd recommend it very highly. |
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Montgomery
"F**k!"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 17:19:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
Couldn't agree with you more on 'Happyness'. There are thousands of books written by successful people, preaching about how all you need to do is stay positive, create your own opportunities, all that self-righteous revisionism of their own path to success, which, as you say, involves luck as well as ability.. also, the majority of people don't enjoy multi-million dollar success.. But this fact does not make good movies, apparently... I would have preferred Happyness if the main character had found self-respect through living his life, rather than simply pursuing cash money dollars.
Okay, I take issue with a few of the comments on this thread, not just Paddy's, but I don't know how to get multiple quotes in my thread, so I'm just going to respond to his.
First, I saw this movie. I did think that Will Smith did a nice job. His performance was understated at times, jubliant when it needed to be. Real. He made me feel for this character. Is the bar lower for him, since he started as the Fresh Prince? Maybe. Not sure. But, I did think he did a very nice job with this role.
Secondly, The movie is based on a true story, so to say, "I would have preferred Happyness if the main character had found self-respect through living his life, rather than simply pursuing cash money dollars." Okay. But, that's not what happened. He did live his life, but his life story included that he made a lot of money and was very successful eventually. You'll notice, that was just a mention at the end, though. The movie focused on his struggle to just get by.
Third. I didn't get from the movie that rich = happy. He noticed that the people going to that job were happy. (Is that a stretch that stockbrokers would be happy? Maybe.) But, something caught his eye and he got into what that career was all about. He was good with numbers. Obviously a good people person. Talked a good game. And was willing to work for what he wanted. I think it's more a statement about doing what is right for you and not giving up. He happened to get really rich. Okay. Fine. That's not the only story there.
In fact, I thought it was a very sweet story about a Dad's dedication to his son. That was the bigger story for me.
SPOILER TO COME. SORRY DON'T KNOW HOW TO DO INVISIBLE TYPE.
If you want to pick on something that's unbelieveable in the movie, how about those machines he was selling, getting stolen and then showing up right when he needs them again to sell them. That was a big, big stretch. I'm sure that wasn't exactly how that happened. In fact, you found out he did get some money during his internship. Whatever. They left that out to make it more dramatic. I can forgive. They said "based on a true story", so that gives them the license.
I would tell people that this was a sweet movie with good performances. I don't think Will will win for his role, but being nominated, I think that isn't completely unreasonable. He did a nice job.
I liked the movie.
EM :) |
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Paddy C
"Does not compute! Lame!"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 18:33:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Montgomery
quote:
Originally posted by Paddy C
Couldn't agree with you more on 'Happyness'. There are thousands of books written by successful people, preaching about how all you need to do is stay positive, create your own opportunities, all that self-righteous revisionism of their own path to success, which, as you say, involves luck as well as ability.. also, the majority of people don't enjoy multi-million dollar success.. But this fact does not make good movies, apparently... I would have preferred Happyness if the main character had found self-respect through living his life, rather than simply pursuing cash money dollars.
Okay, I take issue with a few of the comments on this thread, not just Paddy's, but I don't know how to get multiple quotes in my thread, so I'm just going to respond to his.
I agree with a lot of what you say Monty, like the fact that in parts it's a sweet movie, about a man dedicated to his son, and has good performances from Messrs Smith.
Re Will Smith, I don't think the bar is lower for him, but I do think he could challenge himself a little more than playing a working father, and starring opposite his own son to boot. He does a good everyman though.
Re the economic aspect, I'll try and defend my previous comment somehow!  It's very clear from the film that poor = unhappy. The stockbrokers are happy, and so are the fund managers. Why does Gardner conclude that they're happy? ... because they have fulfilling jobs? It's possible that's this is true, but I'd be more likely to believe it if he was looking at a group of architects, or teachers for example. Stockbrokers, especially in the 80's, made a whole lot of money. Gardner had zero cash and was a smart guy, so he made the connection. The scene in the movie where he stands outside Dean Witter thinking to himself "they all look so happy", is hogwash for me. A more accurate thought would be "they all have such nice watches", and that's not an Oscar-worthy sentiment. To make my point, this sentiment is the turning-point in the movie, describing the character's main motivation... and I didn't go for it. This is pretty much the nub of why the movie rankled with me. (I am getting cynical amn't i!)
I'm not sure I disagree with you entirely Monty, but for me the best parts of this movie weren't the story, the characters, or the message, it was the relationship between father and son. I do think Smith was good, but I certainly don't think he deserves an oscar for what i saw as a capable enough acting job in a movie that, to me at least, that felt like an air-brushed, hollywood revision of events.
My final final problem with the movie is that it is as thinly diguised a star 'vehicle' as i've ever seen.
end of rant!!  |
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 01/18/2007 : 19:13:55
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| I still think everything that I thought previously; I especially think that the changes from the real story are highly significant - many people today live on less than he was living on then, so they changed things to make us feel sympathy for a character who didn't need it even at his poorest. It is always a negative thing when films veer from the truth; sometimes the benefits outweigh this but not this time. |
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The Pursuit of Happyness
