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ragingfluff 
"Currently lost in Canada"
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 Posted - 03/06/2007 : 20:27:52
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Lots of television series "jump the shark" (the point where the show gets ridiculously silly or bad and never recovers, named after the episode of Happy Days where the Fonz jumped over a shark).
I'm interested in movies that do the same; i.e. movies that betray their early promise, where a good first act gives way to ridiculous plot twists or a useless third act. Not necessarily films with bad endings. Lots of good films have bad endings (Minority Report, for example)
I mean movies that completely undermine themselves. An example I watched recently is MAN ON FIRE with Denzel Washington. The first hour is really good and patiently builds up a believable story. The last hour is crap and highly improbable and ruins the whole movie.
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benj clews 
"...."
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Posted - 03/06/2007 : 21:06:17
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I never really knew what this meant until now (I assumed 'Jumping the shark' was somehow avoiding a bad thing and coming away basically unscathed- bit of a misleading phrase until you know the origin, I guess  ).
Anyway, this sounds a bit like what I used to call the "Oh... fuck off!!!" moment, namely because I'd be sat in my seat and find myself uttering that quite loudly at a preposterous event happening onscreen. If I hadn't eaten my popcorn by this point, I'd be stoning the projectionist with it.
Still, I'm really having to think hard for films that started so fantastically and then pissed it all away in a moment of madness.
I think the Nicholas Cage 'Gone In Sixty Seconds' managed it with the stupid jump near the end, mind.
James Bond films are probably ripe for this, too. 'Licence To Kill' with the truck-on-two-wheels-to-avoid-the-rocket being the first one to spring to mind. Oh... and too much to recount in 'Moonraker'.
And 'The Beach'. All went fine until the painfully awful 'Computer Game' scene- I know it was whilst supposed to be while he was off his head on something, but still... what the??? |
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Sal[Au]pian 
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 03/06/2007 : 21:11:25
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quote:
Originally posted by benj clews
I never really knew what this meant until now
It's an odd coincidence that this has come up again. I'd never heard of it in my life until it was mentioned in the F.Y.C.T.H. Here's the website. |
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turrell 
"Ohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh "
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 02:35:05
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| Movies are too short to really qualify for Jumping the Shark - they don't have enough of a history really to be good and then jump. Unless you are talking about a series - for example Star Wars certainly jumped the Shark with Epsiode I - Jar Jar - horrible dialogue, etc. |
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Downtown 
"Welcome back, Billy Buck"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 03:27:01
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quote:
Originally posted by turrell
Movies are too short to really qualify for Jumping the Shark - they don't have enough of a history really to be good and then jump. Unless you are talking about a series - for example Star Wars certainly jumped the Shark with Epsiode I - Jar Jar - horrible dialogue, etc.
That represents the lowest point in the series, but by no means was it the beginning of the end of anything. Calling The Phantom Menace "jumping the shark" is totally inaccurate, if not from an artistic standpoint, then certainly considering what Revenge of the Sith did at the box office. "Jumping the shark" is the moment when it becomes glaringly obvious that a series has gone on too long and should end, and while TPM pretty much sucked, I'm glad the series continued after that.
Anyway, First Blood was a tragic story about a country that had no place for a man that faithfully served it, and threw him away. First Blood: Part II tried to recreate that with Napier's character selling him out, but it really just came out as one man single-handedly winning the Vietnam War (in 1985), killing a whole bunch Soviets along the way, because they were in Vietnam for some reason and killing Soviets was cool in the 80s. Then he killed lots more Soviets in Afghanistan in Rambo III. |
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turrell
"Ohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh Ohhhh "
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 03:53:28
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For me it was jumping the Shark - I thought the entire second trilogy was a waste of time, and basically Lucas trying to piece every last part of the puzzle together. The movies could not stand on their own as movies but merely sought to explain every last bit of back story in the series - can you imagine Tarantino destroying the brilliance of Pulp Fiction by putting out 3 sequels explaining every little mystery?
Maybe for the sci fi geeks these movies were interesting, but I thought they were downhill starting with Jar-Jar. |
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ChocolateLady
"500 Chocolate Delights"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 06:27:07
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Using this interpretation, I'd say that everything after the press conference in Notting Hill was jumping the shark, including the stuff that went with the closing credits.
And while it recovered later in the movie there was some shark jumping in Casion Royale during the recovery and lovey-dovey bits.
Love, Actually jumped the shark about six or seven times throughout the movie, but the big jump was Bill Nighy... er... unique TV performance.
Titanic jumped the shark probably before this scene, but certainly with the stupid hand on the inside of the window of the car scene.
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Conan The Westy
"Father, Faithful Friend, Fwiffer"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 07:26:34
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| In Speed it jumped the shark when the bus's nose lifted and it rose majestically in the air to complete the leap over the freeway overpass roadworks (when in reality it should have nosedived into a flaming explosion on the ground below). |
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BaftaBaby 
"Always entranced by cinema."
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 08:26:16
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quote:
Originally posted by turrell
Movies are too short to really qualify for Jumping the Shark - they don't have enough of a history really to be good and then jump. Unless you are talking about a series - for example Star Wars certainly jumped the Shark with Epsiode I - Jar Jar - horrible dialogue, etc.
I totally agree with you, Turrell ... Jumping The Shark is primarily about sustaining an established 'brand' for want of a better word. I've been trying to think of other professions it could apply to: I guess it's like when a famous cola brand [no free advertising - but you know the one that started producing bottled water, and then found it contained a horrible chemical and has to be taken off the shelves.   ] ... well, IF they started messing with the original best-selling cola formula and the original bottle and peddled it as NEW! IMPROVED! but everyone who'd ever tasted the original just knew ... they'd Jumped that Soda Shark!
But back to movies ... in addition to sequels you could include re-makes which have been made just because ...
IF some 12-year-old studio exec decided to remake, for example, Casablanca or Citizen Kane ... imho that would be JtS.
So: The Postman Always Rings Twice ... Postman Jumped!
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Beanmimo
"August review site"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 09:17:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Conan The Westy
In Speed it jumped the shark when the bus's nose lifted and it rose majestically in the air to complete the leap over the freeway overpass roadworks (when in reality it should have nosedived into a flaming explosion on the ground below).
What a great twist that would have been.
Anyone seen A History of Violence.
Third act completely bottomed out. |
Edited by - Beanmimo on 03/07/2007 09:17:58 |
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silly
"That rabbit's DYNAMITE."
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 18:45:01
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"Catwoman."
Started out brilliantly - with that bit about "Warner Brothers."
Then the movie started and I threw up in my mouth a little. |
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ragingfluff
"Currently lost in Canada"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 21:58:36
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quote:
Originally posted by turrell
Movies are too short to really qualify for Jumping the Shark - they don't have enough of a history really to be good and then jump. Unless you are talking about a series - for example Star Wars certainly jumped the Shark with Epsiode I - Jar Jar - horrible dialogue, etc.
I disagree. My point is that a film can have a good start/premise/first act, then peak with something ridiculous (usually in the third act), and after that it's downhill (in every sense) all the way...
I agree that sequels certainly qualify (see the Matrix Trilogy), but I still think a film can betray its own good intentions, usually because scriptwriters run out of good ideas. "Adaptation" does this but does it knowingly and blatantly. I haven't seen "Flightplan", but everything I've heard indicates an example of this
...Maybe a film jumps the shark with the appearance of a Deus Ex Machina.
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lemmycaution
"Long mired in film"
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Shiv
"What a Wonderful World"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 22:42:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Salopian
quote:
Originally posted by benj clews
I never really knew what this meant until now
It's an odd coincidence that this has come up again. I'd never heard of it in my life until it was mentioned in the F.Y.C.T.H. Here's the website.
Then go vote on the relevant Jaws 4 reviews |
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Shiv
"What a Wonderful World"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 22:48:39
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quote:
Originally posted by turrell
For me it was jumping the Shark - I thought the entire second trilogy was a waste of time, and basically Lucas trying to piece every last part of the puzzle together. The movies could not stand on their own as movies but merely sought to explain every last bit of back story in the series - can you imagine Tarantino destroying the brilliance of Pulp Fiction by putting out 3 sequels explaining every little mystery?
Maybe for the sci fi geeks these movies were interesting, but I thought they were downhill starting with Jar-Jar.
I'm not a Lucas/Star Wars faniac or anything, but I saw him being interviewed where he said he conceieved of all six films/storylines in the 70s, but wanted to wait for the improvements in special effects to film the first three. In other words, the last three films weren't filling in story backwards from the first three, they were always following on from them. Anyone else heard him talk/write about this? (Boy, it's hard making logical sense in this paragraph when 'the first three' are really 'the last three' ) |
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Shiv
"What a Wonderful World"
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Posted - 03/07/2007 : 22:58:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Beanmimo
Anyone seen A History of Violence.
Third act completely bottomed out.
Yes, I liked it. I thought the conviction of the actors carried it through the foray into 'gangster land' - and at least it didn't have a twee happy ending. I'd go into more detail but I don't want to give spoilers. |
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Films that Jump the Shark
