| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
BaftaBaby 
"Always entranced by cinema."
|
 Posted - 06/13/2007 : 12:17:58
|
You know how when it's a scorcher of a day, and you're lazing by the sea and it just gets too darn hot, so you lever yourself from the lounger and surrender your body to the cool water? Then, you're back in baking mode and just how long is it before you can't even remember the refreshing dip because it's like it never happened, and you need another jump in the ocean?
That's what this movie Ocean is like. There's plenty to engage you while you're eyeballing Soderbergh's meticulous direction [and pseudononymously credited] camerawork, and - amid many pages of exposition - chuckling at a handful of amusing lines spoken by a cast completely at ease with each other and with their own forays into disguise. That's all fine and dandy and scratches your itch for a caper to add to the briney franchise.
It's not till later - if, that is you can be bothered to go over all those niggly loose ends - that you realize the plotting of the film is such a stranger to reality it might have been written by The Brothers Grimm, and damn if you feel you haven't even seen a film at all.
I won't go into all the nooks and crannies of script anomalies, but I'll just ask a few pertinent questions which I don't believe will spoil anything for you:
1. How come when a gang needs to infiltrate the staff of an establishment to carry out their plans, whether it's a shiny new Vegas hotel or a run-down factory south of the border ... how is it that despite employment regulations and hiring rigamarole, and a waiting line of job-seekers in a high unemployment era -- how come it's the gang guys who get the job/s?
2. If a spray-on love potion exists which reduces an intelligent, attractive woman to fixate on any man to the exclusion of her judgment on all matters that don't include instant sexual gratification ... why hasn't such a potion been more widely available in the marketplace, and why are there still so many frustrated men and women around? Supplementary question: how demeaning to women do we think this may be merely to supply a plot point which might have been achieved in a far more engaging way?
3. Where could the massed forces of the Nevada police force* have been while a multi-million ton machine was somehow imported into their territory and deployed in a sub-terranean procedure so precisely targetted that the entire surrounding neighborhood escapes from its effects? Supplementary question: would someone care to explain the physics of that procedure in layman's terms?
4. If you were building a multi-billion dollar play palace and were egomaniacal enough to display a case of near priceless diamonds, what would make you place such a case directly under roof-top access?
*oops! Thanks, MrBI for correcting my geography ... dunno WTF happened there  
|
Edited by - BaftaBaby on 06/13/2007 15:18:21 |
|
|
Whippersnapper. 
"A fourword thinking guy."
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 13:17:50
|
You mean this film actually requires the viewer to suspend disbelief? 
It's an outrage! 
|
 |
|
|
ChocolateLady 
"500 Chocolate Delights"
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 13:37:16
|
| Out of deference to the memory of my mother, who thought the Rat Pack were the... er... bees knees, I refused to watch these movies. Now I know why. |
|
|
|
Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 14:22:05
|
Ocean's Thirteen
In answer to Bafta's points...
1. I don't mind this - one can just say that they are highly skilled con artists who can talk their way into anything.
2. Yes, this is a very fair point. It is really sexist and does indeed beg the question of why they don't sell this product - that would make them far more money than any of their schemes.
3. This is an accurate point but not one I mind so much.
4. Yup, this is quite ridiculous. Indeed the whole design of the building seems extremely unlikely. (I assume it was C.G.I. and not a real one.)
However, I really, really loved it, and was completely buzzing as I walked out of the cinema. Best of the three, I would say. |
Edited by - Demisemicenturian on 06/20/2007 23:11:23 |
|
|
|
MisterBadIdea 
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 14:38:05
|
quote:
1. How come when a gang needs to infiltrate the staff of an establishment to carry out their plans, whether it's a shiny new Vegas hotel or a run-down factory south of the border ... how is it that despite employment regulations and hiring rigamarole, and a waiting line of job-seekers in a high unemployment era -- how come it's the gang guys who get the job/s?
Doctored resumes, perhaps, not to mention the fact that the lovely charm that makes them so fun to watch also probably helps them during interviews.
quote:
2. If a spray-on love potion exists which reduces an intelligent, attractive woman to fixate on any man to the exclusion of her judgment on all matters that don't include instant sexual gratification ... why hasn't such a potion been more widely available in the marketplace, and why are there still so many frustrated men and women around? Supplementary question: how demeaning to women do we think this may be merely to supply a plot point which might have been achieved in a far more engaging way?
Perhaps it's prohibitively expensive (except of course for these guys, who are all collectively richer than God). I will grant you that there was something very icky about that scene, too much so for this light, breezy heist movie.
quote:
3. Where could the massed forces of the New Mexican police force have been while a multi-million ton machine was somehow imported into their territory and deployed in a sub-terranean procedure so precisely targetted that the entire surrounding neighborhood escapes from its effects? Supplementary question: would someone care to explain the physics of that procedure in layman's terms?
Nevadan, not New Mexican. Anyway, I look forward to Ocean's Fourteen, where Elliott Gould dies and they make the Earth spin backwards to turn back time and save his life.
quote:
4. If you were building a multi-billion dollar play palace and were egomaniacal enough to display a case of near priceless diamonds, what would make you place such a case directly under roof-top access?
Uh... I got nothin'.
quote:
Out of deference to the memory of my mother, who thought the Rat Pack were the... er... bees knees, I refused to watch these movies. Now I know why.
...That doesn't make any sense. |
Edited by - MisterBadIdea on 06/13/2007 14:44:22 |
|
|
|
demonic
"Cinemaniac"
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 15:35:10
|
quote:
Originally posted by MisterBadIdea
Anyway, I look forward to Ocean's Fourteen, where Elliott Gould dies and they make the Earth spin backwards to turn back time and save his life.
This made me laugh, mainly because Danny and chums would probably try to do it considering how all their "impossible" missions so far have actually been relatively easy to pull off - at least in movie-suspension-of-disbelief land. In this one they are never more than lightly hindered from the start to the finish.
My biggest problem, aside from the smugness that has pervaded the whole trilogy, is that an act of revenge doesn't have high stakes - there is no personal risk involved other than the old "honour amongst thieves" code and that makes for a pretty dull, but
largely watchable and mostly entertaining, two hours.
The cast is pretty wasted - Pacino never gets into gear, Barkin is as Baffy rightly points out rather shamelessly treated as an easy mark, and none of the team really gets a chance to shine. I suppose Damon has the most fun and actually comes across as the best actor, and Caan and Affleck get the best humour particularly in the Mexico section. Eddie Izzard should only be allowed comedy roles, because he definitely shows he's no dramatic actor (again). And where on earth did they exhume Julian Sands from?
Finally you know, oh how you know, that the crew are going to pull it all off without any major mishaps, no matter how Soderbergh might try to throw a few curveballs - they're never convincing in the slightest. A little less rose-tinted Vegas nostalgia and a bit more tension would have gone a long way. |
|
|
|
Whippersnapper.
"A fourword thinking guy."
|
Posted - 06/13/2007 : 16:36:37
|
quote:
Originally posted by demonic
My biggest problem, aside from the smugness that has pervaded the whole trilogy, is that an act of revenge doesn't have high stakes - there is no personal risk involved other than the old "honour amongst thieves" code and that makes for a pretty dull, but
largely watchable and mostly entertaining, two hours.
Dull but entertaining? 
|
|
|
|
Conan The Westy
"Father, Faithful Friend, Fwiffer"
|
Posted - 06/16/2007 : 13:13:09
|
quote:
Originally posted by Whippersnapper
Dull but entertaining?
Just saw it and I'd say it's a fair assessment.
Clooney and Pitt do "suave" very well though. |
|
|
|
w22dheartlivie
"Kitty Lover"
|
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 06:58:53
|
quote:
Originally posted by Conan The Reporter
quote:
Originally posted by Whippersnapper
Dull but entertaining?
Just saw it and I'd say it's a fair assessment.
Clooney and Pitt do "suave" very well though.
I suspect that's because they were just being themselves. |
|
|
|
BaftaBaby
"Always entranced by cinema."
|
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 08:38:21
|
quote:
Originally posted by wildhartlivie
quote:
Originally posted by Conan The Reporter
quote:
Originally posted by Whippersnapper
Dull but entertaining?
Just saw it and I'd say it's a fair assessment.
Clooney and Pitt do "suave" very well though.
I suspect that's because they were just being themselves.
Uhm ... I'll TRY not to be insulted on behalf of good actors everywhere.
|
Edited by - BaftaBaby on 06/17/2007 08:38:58 |
|
|
|
ChocolateLady
"500 Chocolate Delights"
|
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 11:39:19
|
Now, see... I can see Clooney doing "suave" very well, but I can't see Pitt's attempt coming out as anything but "arrogant". To be suave, you have to be refined, courteous and able to know how to be just self-deprecating enough to lure the other person with your charms. There's a very fine line between suave and arrogant, and someone who is the latter is far too smug to even notice if they're getting through to the people around them or not - they assume they are effective, even when they're not. Someone who is suave, will watch others' reactions to him and adjust his behaviour in order to make sure they're being effective. Anybody can do arrogant, but it takes real talent to be suave.
|
|
|
|
Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
|
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 18:20:09
|
| Actually, we don't see so much of Pitt in this one - he is much more prominent in Twelve, and I would say he's pretty much suave (though not Bond-style suave). He and Clooney are also better-looking in that one, but this one is still much the superior. |
|
|
|
Downtown 
"Welcome back, Billy Buck"
|
Posted - 06/20/2007 : 22:44:25
|
| Just adding one more each time - 11, 12, 13 - is so obvious. They should have called it "Ocean's Ten" or something. That would have been cool. Besides, 13 is a lot of people to have on a single job. The more people involved, the greater the chances someone blabs. |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
Ocean's Thirteen
