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Sean 
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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 Posted - 10/30/2007 : 23:48:11
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Edited by - Sean on 10/30/2007 23:48:43 |
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Sean
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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Posted - 10/30/2007 : 23:48:53
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quote:
Originally posted by dem8nic
I just find the lengths they are having to go to to get a response out of a largely numbed audience repellent. Unfashionable as it is, and mock away if you're inclined, I'm starting to think the general public's increasing fascination with torture porn is symptomatic of a general disregard for human life (at least in the UK - people in the US have been regularly shooting and stabbing each other for no reason for years so I can't comment on that). I'm hoping that it's a phase that will pass and we can get back to actually frightening movies, not films only designed to repulse.
Fair points. But, I don't see that fact that people are increasingly requiring more extreme fake violence in movies as being symptomatic of anything becoming wrong with society. I for one can't be shocked/impressed by any violence in a movie - as long as I know it's fake. But I've got an extremely low tolerance for real gore or even blood-free violence. E.g., I'm a real wuss when it comes to cuts and open wounds.    And I don't want to be near people when they're fighting even if there's no blood at all. And, I made the big mistake of watching <next few sentences contains information about something extremely disturbing I watched, I'll inviso it> one of those beheading videoclips from Iraq a few years ago, I have no idea why I watched it but I found it very easily on the net late at night as I was about to retire and watched it. Essentially it was a live hostage having his head slowly sawn off by a sadistic psychopathic serial killer (probably Zarqawi who's now dead thank god) with a knife. The clip also contained sound. I watched glued to the screen with sickened fascination until it was over, then I got up from my PC, went to the bathroom, had my head over the toilet for a few minutes on the verge of puking. When the nausea abated I looked at myself in the mirror and I was totally white, I looked like a corpse. Then for the next half hour I wandered around the house in a daze, I was bumping into walls, doorways etc. I finally went to bed and had a tortured night's sleep, I kept waking up with images of this grotesque act of evil in my head. I totally regret watching it and totally recommend that nobody does anything so stupid as to find one of these and watch it (and don't ask for links). I just mentioned this as it suggests that the fact people need more and more gore to be entertained doesn't necessarily mean that they're becoming sicker, it may just mean that they have a filtering mechanism that seperates reality from fiction. Although I suppose there may be people around who aren't able to seperate the two, and if they become accustomed to fake violence then perhaps they've also become accustomed to real violence. This debate has been going on for decades. |
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MisterBadIdea 
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
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Posted - 10/31/2007 : 04:20:55
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quote:
I'm hoping that it's a phase that will pass and we can get back to actually frightening movies, not films only designed to repulse.
quote:
Gore doesn't do anything for me at all. I'm always looking at the gore and the blood and thinking about whether the colour/consistency is realistic or not. All I see is makeup, which is what it is.
I am so far from these perspectives that I don't really understand them. The first makes as much sense to me as saying, "I hope we can get back to funny movies rather than just scary ones." The second one, well, all movies are completely fake, and actors are faking it, I don't see what's the difference with the gore and makeup effects. I very much appreciate the defense of society against the charges of increased amorality, though, and I wholeheartedly agree with it.
Getting back to the Saw movies specifically, yeah, you don't care much about the characters in Saw II, and that is my least favorite thing about it. However, I don't see how that does not apply to Saw I. Matter of fact, I cared about exactly two people in Saw II: Jigsaw and Donnie Wahlberg. There's a great scene where Jigsaw asks Officer Wahlberg what the last thing he said to his son was, and he's forced to remember that his last words were angry shouting for him to get out of his sight. There's nothing like that in Saw I.
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Sean
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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Posted - 10/31/2007 : 04:49:36
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quote:
Originally posted by MisterBadIdea
I am so far from these perspectives that I don't really understand them.
Actually a similar thought occurred to me, that you and I will never be fighting over a place at a queue in a cinema as we'll be queueing up for very different movies.   I often don't understand your perspective on what makes a good movie or bad movie. No worries though, each to their own. Fortunately there are enough movies out there to keep everyone happy. 
BTW, care to list your Best 10-20 or so Movies Ever list? My guess is it'll be completely different to mine. |
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MisterBadIdea
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
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Posted - 10/31/2007 : 04:58:56
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Don't really have them ordered, but here's what I list as my favorite movies on my Facebook page:
Hedwig and the Angry Inch
King Kong (2005)
Kalifornia
Night of the Living Dead
Final Destination 3
Say Anything
High Plains Drifter
Dogville
What's Eating Gilbert Grape
Who Framed Roger Rabbit?
Airplane!
Almost Famous
The Departed
Pan's Labyrinth
Boogie Nights
Memento
The Virgin Suicides
Apocalypto
Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
Rocky
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Edited by - MisterBadIdea on 10/31/2007 04:59:19 |
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Sean
"Necrosphenisciform anthropophagist."
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Posted - 10/31/2007 : 05:52:12
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Well that list is pretty good overall. Looks like I was wrong. A few comments of mine in red...quote:
Originally posted by MisterBadIdea
All these ones I regard as very good to excellent, i.e, 7.5-10/10.
King Kong (2005)
Night of the Living Dead
High Plains Drifter
Dogville
What's Eating Gilbert Grape
Who Framed Roger Rabbit?
Airplane!
Almost Famous
Pan's Labyrinth
Boogie Nights
Memento
The Virgin Suicides
Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind
These ones ordinary but passable, i.e., 6-7/10
Apocalypto
Rocky
Ain't seen these...
Hedwig and the Angry Inch
Kalifornia
Final Destination 3
Say Anything
The Departed
I just sorted my reviews by movie score and here are the 6/5 movies, i.e, 10/10 or more in random order...
12 Angry Men
2001 A Space Odyssey
La Consequenza del l'amore
The Deer Hunter
Fantasia
Godfather
March of the Penguins
Grave of the Fireflies
The Incredibles
Latcho Drom
LOTR Extended Cut x 3
Lost in Translation
Machuca
Memento
Once Upon a Time in America
Roman Holiday
Fucking �m�l
Spirited Away
The Third Man
Good, Bad and Ugly
Once Upon a Time in the West
Pulp Fiction
not much in common with yours I suppose, only Memento.  |
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MisterBadIdea
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
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Posted - 10/31/2007 : 13:47:35
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Unseen:
La Consequenza del l'amore
Fantasia
Fucking �m�l
Latcho Drom
Machuca
Four stars:
2001 A Space Odyssey
Godfather
Grave of the Fireflies
The Incredibles
Lord of the Rings trilogy
Memento
Once Upon a Time in America
Spirited Away
The Third Man
Good, Bad and Ugly
Once Upon a Time in the West
Pulp Fiction
3 1/2 stars:
12 Angry Men
2 1/2 stars
The Deer Hunter
March of the Penguins
Lost in Translation
Not good:
Roman Holiday |
Edited by - MisterBadIdea on 10/31/2007 13:48:42 |
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Demisemicenturian 
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 11/05/2007 : 10:27:12
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Saw IV
My order of preference: Saw, Saw II/Saw IV, Saw III. I thought that Saw was just awesome.
I cannot relate to anyone being interested in gore. In most cases (vampires, people getting beaten up, disaster scenarios etc. etc.) I am completely indifferent to blood and guts - so long as it is fictional. I don't mind medical scenes whether fictional or not. In torture contexts, I absolutely hate it (i.e. I hate seeing any aspect of torture), so I watch those scenes of these films through my fingers. It's the set-up that I like, both in terms of getting the characters in place and the physical conundrum they end up in - I thought the one at the start of the this one (with the two men chained) was great. |
Edited by - Demisemicenturian on 11/05/2007 12:35:24 |
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MisterBadIdea
"PLZ GET MILK, KTHXBYE"
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Posted - 11/05/2007 : 14:36:18
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quote:
In torture contexts, I absolutely hate it (i.e. I hate seeing any aspect of torture), so I watch those scenes of these films through my fingers.
That doesn't sound like indifference at all, I would point out.
Thought of another reason Saw III is easily the best: It takes a definite perspective towards the victims. See, horror movies need to have a perspective towards its victims: Kill 'em or don't kill 'em, sympathetic or unsympathetic. Otherwise the deaths mean nothing, which is the biggest problem with Saw and Saw II, where you don't really care about any of the victims (perhaps excepting Donnie Wahlberg). In Saw III, we realize the victims -- all of them -- don't really deserve to be there, and that clarity is helpful. Jigsaw's realization of his ultimate failure at the end of the movie is also pretty damn affecting, I thought. The third movie is much like a very bloody character drama, which gives it more flesh beyond the cheap gimmickry of the other movies. |
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 11/05/2007 : 14:41:32
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quote:
Originally posted by MrBadIdea
quote:
In torture contexts, I absolutely hate it (i.e. I hate seeing any aspect of torture), so I watch those scenes of these films through my fingers.
That doesn't sound like indifference at all, I would point out.
Which is why it was a separate point, quite obviously. I said "In most cases (vampires, people getting beaten up, disaster scenarios etc. etc.) I am completely indifferent to blood and guts - so long as it is fictional." Torture cases are the other cases. |
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Demisemicenturian
"Four ever European"
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Posted - 04/28/2008 : 01:56:32
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I'm just bumping this thread in light of Randall having just seen Saw.
I'm not as disappointed with the sequels as most people. I think they do quite well to extend the concept. However, Saw III is certainly the weakest. |
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Saw IV
